Why have weak women become cool?

Ok, I'm not a fan of Twilight and never even made it all the way through the first book, but I agree Bella was very helpless. Although I think the reason girls like her is that they relate to her. She's clumsy and very "real". I didn't finish the book so I'm not sure how emotionally strong she ended up being, so I can't say anything on that count. Although my impression of her wasn't very favourable.
I have to disagree with you about Hermione though. The last word I would use to describe her would be "weak". In fact, she was one of the strongest characters in the whole series. So what if she burst into tears every once in a while. It's called hormones and teenage girls do it sometimes. Male teenagers aren't affected the same way. But Hermione was fiercely intelligent, steadfast, excellent in a tight spot. In fact, of the 3 main characters- she's the one I'd pick to have at my back in a fight.
BTW I'd never heard of this spot before someone posted a link to this article on the Buffy spot. I'm definitely going to join! =)

yeah i agree on bella .i did..with a lot of skimming..finish the first book and she got on my nerves endlessly. apart from her being clumsy..fair enough..i just didnt like the way she fell in love with edward for..well no reason actually. something aboot his eyes changing colour. and she ignored all people around her (who, granted, seemed to be little TOO obsessed with shopping) but still seemed to take an interest in her as a person and wanted to be her friend! but no..all boring compared to edward the guy who basically up until one third of the book treated her like crap.

as much as that isnt a welcomed portrayal of a woman today i would have to report, when looking around my friends and acquaintances, it isnt THAT far off..
i know plenty of cool women with great careers, looks, personality, humor etc who absolutely vanish in their relationships. one moment they are making decisions, standing up to their boss etc and next they are running home cause their boyfriends dont like it when they stay oot too late.

Wow. 100% true. That's pretty much all there is to say. So many women that are in today's T.V. shows and limelight are truly pegged as helpless. I miss shows like Buffy, that weren't just great because of the storyline, but were all about female empowerment. Even Buffy had romance, had the boyfriends, but it wasn't JUST about the boyfriend. I haven't read the Twilight books, but I did see the movie, and there was not a single female in the movie that was strong-willed and basically kick-ass. Not much of a fan of Harry Potter, but I understand what you mean there. Personally, I like my shows with some female empowerment, but with some romance to add a little spice to it. The problem with the shows and books and movies now, is that there's not a balance in between. I read a book one time, where the main character, Morgan, was the best fighter in the land, who could beat any man up. Then she "falls in love" in the first book, but never acts upon the feelings. But in the second book, she went from this strong-willed woman to being a weak, helpless girl who had to be saved around every corner! It wasn't even the same woman, which ruined the entire series for me.
But, you are 100% correct!

You're 100% right. I agree so much about the Twilight-books.
I'm a bit fanatic about them myself, but I really don't understand why! There must be something wierdly addictive about them, because I absolutley despise the writer and the main plot. It's unbelivable that a woman thinks about other women like that - the whole series is just plain chauvinistic. This girl falls head over heels in love with a man for NO REASON, then he gets extremely posessive and she thinks it's romantic, and so do all the little girls who read it. Oh yay.
But this is all around us, and it really makes me upset. Women have been fighting for respect for ages, but now Paris Hilton and company are parading around acting stupid because that's what the producers want, and sending a message that fame and big boobs are more important than intellegence and education. And people actually idolize these celebrities! Okay, I'm getting a little carried away here. But I think this is one of the reasons of soppy sappy female characters becoming almost fashionable.

i agree about the twilight books. i am a fan of these books myself, but bella seriously annoyed the crap out of me throughout all the serie. she falls in love with edward this absolutely perfect guy that can do everything perfectly and has perfect grades, perfect maners. perfect, perfect, perfect. and then what does bella say and think? that she cannot stand up to him. that she doesn't deserve him because he's so perfectly perfect and she's so average and weak. (well she IS pretty pathetic).

plus, she is completely selfless. ok, it may be a quality. but she is ready to sacrifice anything even herself for edward. and then, in the fourth book (spoiler here) bella becomes pregnant with a little half-human half-vampire that is hurting her, breaking her ribs, and all, but she
still wants to keep it. she would give her life to that little monster. it's saying that a woman's life isn't valuable enough, that it can be easily sacrificed, that a woman's role is just to take care of her child and love her husband unconditionally and irrevocably.

but i do have to disagree on one point. when you said that all women in the twilight series are weak.

rosalie is NOT weak. even though i do not like rosalie, she's a pretty strong person in my opinion. she would stand up for herself. but it's true that she's kind of girlie and egotistical. and she would even give up emmett so that she can have a child.

there's also victoria. it's true that she's the vilain in eclipse. but she is strong. she would do anything to get what she wants. even though it's to avenge her mate. she tried to get past the werewolves and created a whole army of vampires.

leah clearwater is also a strong woman. very stubborn, but strong and competitive.
maria. the vampire that created jasper. she was an ambitious person, determined and a leader. having an army on her side and taking over the entire region of mexico and a big territory in the south.

but i got to admit that the characters i just mentioned were not the main character and had smaller parts or were only slightly mentioned in the books, and so would have less influence of the fans that read twilight.

(by the way, the moto for this spot, it doesn't have to be fictional female characters. real strong women also exist)

THANK YOU. So many fangirls in Twilight have tried to argue with the whole "YOU PEOPLE ARE TOO FEMINIST." Even the author herself has said, feminism is about women having their own choice.
Whether it be choosing a independent life or a dependent one? I don't understand Stephenie Meyer's logic. If she promotes young girls choosing a life that women have been forced to live for the last couple centuries...well that isn't a choice at all. Bella chooses married life over college, gets pregnant and lives in a quaint lil cottage with dear old Edward...She's sets women back from all they've fought so hard for. :(

And I'm sorry, but if you think a bubbling girl who's life revolves around a man is perfectly good, then Samantha Jones and Miranda Hobbes will have something else to say about that.

More than one person has used victoria the villain from eclipse as an example that the women in those books are not all weak, but if you think about it I think that makes it worse. In that type of book you want the audience to dislike your villain and believe in the hero. So the hero is a weak stepford like girlfriend and the villain is a strong woman...to me that seems to send a very clear message.

Oh, and burgundyeyes I agree about the spot moto, I'm nt crazy about it either. I created the spot and by the time I got to that I didn't really have much time left and I was trying to think of a quick way to get across the point that it was women from every medium not just movies or tv etc. I was thinking of doing a pick to have people suggest a new moto, because I can't seem to think of a way to quickly and eloquently describe the spot :)

I won't be typing up long paragraphs like everyone else, but I just have to say I definitely agree with you about Bella. I like the Twilight books, but Bella is just horrible! Her character is weak, depressing, & boring. But like fanfly, I have to disagree with you about Hermione. I agree with everything fanfly said :)

I compleatly agree. I am a fan of Harry Potter books, but hermine is to emotional. They also gave the sterotypes of all smart girls being know-it-alls. Bella=boring, weak, lame. Have you ever noticed that in all the princess stories and little girl fairy tales the villian is a woman. Then in comic books and action movies, most of the time the villian is a man. This is so that the boys still think that only men can be strong and powerful. Thats sexistisum for ya.

I can see where everyone is coming from, but I don't really understand why people cannot be fans of weak (emotionally or physically) people, or characters. Just because they're weak, that doesn't make them a bad person. I'm weak, does that make a bad person? No. I don't think Bella's a good role model. But to me, she's extremely relatable. She's 'real'. I can understand her. And THAT is why I like her.

I think the point of the article isn't that there shouldn't be any characters who are weak, or that you have to dislike ones who are, just that it's a worrying trend that society in general is so heavily favouring weakness in female characters at the moment.

Also, when it's a character aimed at young people, who young people try to emulate (like Bella, who influenced many people I've met, and their view of how relationships should be and how women should act in them) I find it irresponsible to have her be such a poor role model, because while some will see her for what she is and not take any life lessons from her there are also many influenced by her behaviour, and when you write a character who some young fans will clearly wish to be like (such as the heroine in a fantasy/romance novel) I feel you have a responsibility to make her a better role model, because you are aware you are influencing your fans, and owe it to them to make that influence a good one.

You say you understand because you are weak. I'm sure that's not true. You were strong enough to voice your opinion even though it's different than what other people were saying. It's sad you think you are weak, and that's what I think poor role models like Bella do. You relate to her and her weakness, well if she'd started out relatable and weak but instead of devoting her life to her (in my opinion, abusive) relationship, she found her stregnth, learnt to take care of herself and become more than she was at the start that would have sent an empowering message to fans who related to her 'If she can become strong and empowered so can I' instead the book chose to send the message that you should stay weak and find a man to protect you, and that's why I dislike the character and books. They had a chance to make people like you end the book feeling uplifted and stronger, but instead ended the books with people thinking 'that's nice, she's weak like me'.

Some very good points. I didn't mean to across as a complete 'I'm so weak and hopeless' character! I assure you I'm not!! Physically I am an utter weakling lol and I believe emotionally I'm pretty weak too. I can't handle emotions well and depend on others a lot. I can assure you though, that I am not waiting for a man to protect me; and that is definately not how I think it should be. Also, Bella hasn't made me think I was weak or anything like that. I've always though that really, I'm a big pessimist. :)

I can completely understand about Edward and Bella's relationship. Edward creeps me out a little, as he is way too controlling. I can understand people's fears too. It annoys me that people can't see Edward's flaws and think of him of as the 'perfect man'.

I had some problems with your points about Harry Potter.

"It's the way the women behave in the book. They burst into tears every 5 minutes."

Uh, no, they don't, actually. We haven't seen any of them crying that much - only Ginny when she thinks she's being expelled, Mrs. Weasley when she sees the dead bodies of her family, Narcissa Malfoy when her son is going to be murdered and -

"Hermione bursting into tears because Ron & Harry become friends again after a fight."

That's the only crying she does. And who knows, she could have been PMSing or something.

As for Ginny-she helped in the Battle of Hogwarts, she performed the Bat-Bogey Hex so well that the Inquisitorial Squad had to let her go, she performs the Patronus charm and saves Harry, Ron and Hermione. So she does have a role other than " to be in love with the hero."

Even though I disagree with the part about Hermione (though her crying at Ron and Harry becoming friends did annoy me, because it just seemed like such a stupid over emotional reaction) I do agree Ginny served no purpose at all but to be Harry's love interest. There's a difference between events and purpose. Thing like participating in the battle are events, not purpose, because remove her from those scenes and the book still works just as well. Outside of her relationship with Harry what did she add to the overall plot? What did she provide in the story that another character didn't? How would the overall story have suffered without her presence? I know it's a matter of opinion, but to me the answer to those questions was nothing, nothing and it wouldn't have. I also think a good example of a pretty lame female character in Harry Potter was Fleur in goblet of fire. The best her school had to offer and she never seemed to pose even a minor threat to the others in the tournement. On the whole I think Harry Potter's women were cool, and I'm a Harry Potter fan, but I found Ginny and Fleur a huge let down.

Yeah, I agree. It's just like the movie, 'Down With Love'. Good movie btw. But back to the point, it's horrible how women are treated now. Like we're little children, even though we can be twice the age as the person treating us like that. And, have you guys ever gone onto some of those star wars sites? It's like they don't even CONSIDER that there would be girls on them! I was playing a star wars video game, (The force unleashed, very violent) and honestly, you could tell they didn't make it for boys AND girls! It's horrible. And some guys today stereotype all girls into two category: stupid and annoying. I was talking with some guys, and when they said one term I wasn't familiar with, and I asked what it meant, they just looked at each other and said, 'Of course you don't understand. What are girls good for anyway?' and left! (or at least, they said something similar to that, I can't quite remember) The other day, I was arm-wrestling with some guys, and when I won, they said I cheated because there was no way I could've have beaten them. The nerve, right? Ugh.

In total agreement to your post.

I agree with abitofaLunaTic. Besides, we see men cry to (Snape, Harry, even Dumbledore does it once).
And Mermaid-Tail, yes Fleur is Barbie-like charater, but some girls ARE like that, there isn`t any rule that every female character must be perfect feministic example.

It's not the fact that she was Barbie-like, it's that she was a triwizard champion who was like that. She must (or should) have been intelligent and skilled to even make it into the competition, I just think it's a shame the only female champion was the only one who never seemed even kind of in with a chance to win. All the male champions posed some sort of competative threat, the female was the only one who didn't. I wouldn't say every female character needs to be a certain way, but considering the part she played in the story, I personally feel she should have been shown as better.

Good point but I don`t think that the fact she never seemed to have chance of victory and her being a female are anyhow connected.

i totally agree with you. AND when people say that people can relate to Bella cause she's so real. i have a problem with it because people don't watch TV or read a book to see what they already have. they do it see something new and out of the ordinary.
Also Stephine Myers didn't even do a good job at making her real. Not every girl is clumsy and weak some girls can be strong and witty.
Also if a girl is like Bella then they are not going to be motivated to do anything there just gonna sit there and wait for there own sparkly vampire to come and save them.
Plus i can't wait for them to stop making the twilight movies because then maybe all of this twilight thing will FINALLY BE OVER!!!

HARRY POTTER ROCKS THE WORLD! TWILIGHT STINKS!